I’m excited to see such debate occurring on the previous land usage post. As evidenced by the discussions you all brought up, the area and statistics of the greater Amidst an unprecedented building boom and surge in urban dwellings and living, the
Sarnoff said the Streetcar was too expensive and would be used to fuel more overdevelopment in areas already overwhelmed by high-rise residential condos. He argued that a fleet of environmentally friendly circulator buses would better serve the city at a much cheaper price.
Is this guy joking? Areas overwhelmed? I’m sorry we might disrupt the calm village like quality that every CBD is supposed to embody. This is what happens when we continue to allow ignorance to exist in our local government. It’s not about providing a benefit to local developers; it’s about creating an urban lifestyle that area residents are craving. The environmentally friendly bus idea is beyond ridiculous. Let’s spend $600,000 a pop on a hybrid “circulator” bus which will a) do nothing to enhance the urban fabric of the community or route b) realize far less ridership numbers than the streetcar could easily guarantee c) make urban life next to impossible for everyone not living within a few blocks of the metromover d) be a gigantic waste of money e) be the worst idea I’ve ever heard and f) continue the terrible parking garage pedestal and further increase area traffic because countless studies always conclude that there is a permanent negative stigma towards buses in the United States.
What irks me is the desire to kill a project even before the facts have been heard. This guy is a lawyer, not a transit planner, engineer, or urban planner. He’s behind ecologically friendly construction in the city but knows little of how to actually create a greener city (here is a hint: it involves making the city denser, easier to walk, and has abundant public transit.) He ran against bad government but is suddenly the epitome of the bad government decisions we are trying to fight. Now, don’t get me wrong this isn’t a tirade against Sarnoff, but rather against the thought process, given the real facts, on the
This comes as Portland just opened another transit line, the Portland Aerial Tram.
There are many cases of local governments or local entities delaying or obstructing the construction of transit projects. Just off the top of my head I can think of several projects delayed infinitely or scrapped all together thanks to nearsighted politicians.
Florida Bullet Train- Counties without mass transit systems wanted to add more stations within their county boundaries, essentially making the state funded bullet train become their transit system. Counties such as Broward and Orange Counties both pushed for stations within 10 miles of each other causing the need to revise the study to take this into account, eventually leading to the Governor pulling funding from the project altogether.
Bay Link- Shut down by the City of Miami Beach thanks in part to their desire to perform their own studies and hold voter referendums on the issue (all of which passed). Now the project sits in limbo.
East-West Metrorail- While this project is still in development, it is starting to have that cloud of death floating over it. Meetings were held to discuss placement of stations. A new route alignment was suggested down 107th instead of the turnpike by FIU (to essentially eliminate an FIU run circulator between the main campus and the engineering center) and was drastically opposed by the City of Sweetwater. This discussion alone moved the operating date from 2012 to 2015. Lately, county commissioners have suggested moving the station away from the Miami Intermodal Center (negating its purpose) and move it to the airport. While studies are conducted to create this new alignment, it should postpone the project by at least another year to a year and a half.
How do we get around these political issues? Do we privatize our public transit? When the subway system was created in New York, a private company built and operated it. Eventually, the company was merged into a larger regional transit authority. Perhaps we need something similar to this in the Miami area. The initial People’s Transportation Plan (the 1 cent version) failed mainly because people did not trust the county commission enough to build the projects they promised. I think the people passed the half-cent version of the same thing just because if they didn’t, what hope would there be for transit development in this county?
I’ve been thinking that if they are upset that theirtax money is being spent on something that will only benifit the Edgewater/Midtown area then maybe they can propose expanding it at a later date to other neighborhoods. I wonder if proposing an extension through the Roads down Coral Way all the way to the Gables would pacify them or make them more opposed as it would take away one of their precious lanes on Coral Way?
Sarnoff is so clueless… can someone let hom know he now represents *downtown* and not just the NIMBYs in the Grove? If only Wynton wasn’t such a lush we wouldn’t be having this discussion…
Commissioner Marc Sarnoff realizes that any public transportation plan must serve the public. How is Metro Rail doing? Public transportation does not work if its only purpose is to funnel money to connected lobbyists and contractors.
It has not been proven that a rail based streetcar along NW 2nd Avenue is the answer. We all know that the $200 Mil projected cost will end up being over $350 Mil. And Miami is broke. Buses can be more flexible at 1/10th the cost.
The Portland Aerial Tram? Its cost was projected at $15 Mil and it is now up to $57 Mil. Please do not be deceived.
Anonymous, How often do you use the bus?
Have you seen the new trolleys lately? The are compact and quiet and they are easy to drive in traffic.
I have used buses and subways in NYC and in Boston. Both NYC and Boston are more dense than Miami and both have routes that have been in place for a century.
The NW 2nd Avenue route proposed for the $350+ Mil rail based streetcar does not go to dense job and residential centers. The vast majority of medical workers at the Jackson/U of M/Courthouse area cannot afford $500,000 condos at Midtown Miami, for example.
There is no reason the City and the County cannot simply add buses and create several new routes that they know from experience will be used. The other great benefit of buses is that more buses can be added to routes that are popular. And all that for one tenth the cost of a rail based system.
Just as i thought… it’s always entertaining to hear criticism of our transit system from those who have no experience using it. And just to clarify, many Metrobus routes have been in operation since the 1930s, ever since our original streetcar system was torn up.
In any case, ‘choice riders’ (those who have a car available for use) will not use a bus if it is operating in mixed traffic, especially here in Miami, where you are generally guaranteed of having a parking space available at your destination. Rail systems operaing in mixed traffic *will* attract choice riders, whereas buses will not.
I would rather discuss reality. Miami is auto oriented. Almost everyone is forced to use cars because either their homes or their jobs have no access to mass transit. Or even if they do have some access they might have to leave their jobs to attend a meeting or an appointment. And the meeting or appointment location might be miles from any mass transit. It is not just about access to parking. Many people cannot either stand around for hours waiting for mass transit or they cannot walk miles in the sun. Or both.
Let us use buses. Buses fit in our budget. (We are broke.)
Do not forget what happened with the PAC Center. It came in over $100 Mil over budget and years late. Now it loses $100,000 per month. Guess who covers the loss?
Let me get this straight, you are saying we should not expand mass transit because people wont use it because they currently live too far from the current mass transit?
I agree. The proposed streetcar scheme will not work. The route is wrong. And most importantly the City of Miami screws up every project. Maybe when Manny Diaz is gone we can look again.
What about the FEC Corridor? Let’s get that funded. Isn’t it 85 miles long and 135′ wide?
So your ideology is to place the train on rails that exist but currently do not have any housing nearby? Makes no sense…
I’m really tired of the arguments that “Miami is not dense enough for transit” and no one rides transit here, so why build more?”. People using these arguments are actually making the case for streetcar/rail transit. One of the most prominent reasons for building rail transit like the streetcar is that they stimulate infill development along their corridors. These medium-to-high density corridors do a great job supporting transit. Bus systems, on the other hand, do not stimulate infill development.
See, transportation and housing have a symbiotic relationship. However one is built, the form of the other will follow suit. That’s one reason why buses don’t work, because they are still merely a functional entity of the automobile realm. In the case of the Miami Streetcar, it is proposed along a fairly dense corridor that will be booming with infill development in the coming years. In a strange twist of fate, the City of Miami is finally trying to be progressive by building the streetcar now to compliment proposed future development instead of just reacting to a congestion problem that needed fixing 20 years prior.
Moreover, the pro-bus argument is just not logical (well, it is Miami logic). Adding more buses to the streets when traffic is expected to as much as triple in the next 25 years doesn’t make a whole lot of sense, does it? So of course you’ll counter by saying something like “Oh, but the streetcars are not different because they’ll be in the roads, too”. Wrong. As I said above, the streetcars (as well as other fixed rail transit) will stimulate infill development that will be mixed-use and much more pedestrian-friendly. This will allow people living along the rail corridors to live a more traditional urban life where the pedestrian realm is much more prominent and people don’t have to depend on driving for everything.
Lastly, I’m guessing that most streetcar/rail-haters are either car-lovers or live in some suburban-style neighborhood where they rely on cars for everything, think transit should only be implemented to lessen congestion (so they can drive easier), and have not experienced tradtional urban lifestyle.
Oh, and another thing; stop saying that Miami is “broke” because that is false (as pointed out in today’s Miami Herald). Even if the City is tight on cash, which scenario is more logical? Scenario A: Do the Miami thing and go for a cheap, short-term fix to congestion while traffic gets worse and worse or Scenario B: Start implementing long term solutions now to prepare for future growth and congestion, opposed to waiting another 20 years to build anything when traffic will be much worse than today and any project will be much more expensive
I choose B.
The FEC Corridor runs directly through most of the most dense areas in South Florida. It exists and it is 135′ wide and it is available. Why not get it funded now?
Whatever the financial pros/cons of the streetcar, it has to serve the residents of the City of Miami. So those living outside city limits can sit this one out.
Will it work? From experiences in other cities, there is no doubt. A well designed cityscape, enhanced with streetcar mobility, will lead to greater quality of life for city residents.